Hit & Run's Presidential Debate Live Blog
Comments to "Hit & Run's Presidential Debate Live Blog":
Jon H | October 15, 2008, 9:06pm | #
I think McCain had Nancy's pelvis broken.He was still pissed about the last debate where he mentioned Ted Kennedy but Ted was already out of the hospital.
This time, he knows Nancy ain't going anywhere.
Kent "Flounder" Dorfman | October 15, 2008, 9:07pm | #
Oh, boy! This is gonna be great!Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:08pm | #
I don't remember McCain blinking this much before.Pantsfan | October 15, 2008, 9:09pm | #
sorry, I'm watching the Rangers game.rhywun | October 15, 2008, 9:09pm | #
I'm missing the Project Runway finale--this better be good.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:11pm | #
along the lines for Ian said, if I refresh the comments on the reason blog, it freezes the coveritlive ap.nonPaulogist | October 15, 2008, 9:12pm | #
"Fanny and Freddy Mae"????Nice one Johnny.
Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:12pm | #
Joe the Plumber is a great American.Jerry | October 15, 2008, 9:13pm | #
Don't mind me picking up "plumber" as tonight's drinking word.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:13pm | #
I like to see what XOM does the second half of '08. They actually underperformed expectations with oil at 140+. If it stays down at 70 or so, they're going to be hurtinMister DNA | October 15, 2008, 9:14pm | #
Why no moderated live reader comments in the liveblog?It starts with a "d" and ends with an "ondero", that's why.
Kolohe, do what I'm doing - open the reader comments in a separate tab...
Pantsfan | October 15, 2008, 9:15pm | #
The American People, and the Rangers, loseSparky | October 15, 2008, 9:15pm | #
A trillion dollar deficit. Jesus fucking shit monkeys."Aren't you both ignoring reality?"
GEE, YA THINK, BOB?!?
Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:15pm | #
Man, this shoulda been an IRC party!troll | October 15, 2008, 9:15pm | #
I would blather incessantly and be banned repeatedly. I would think I'm funny. T'would be good.SIV | October 15, 2008, 9:16pm | #
REASON's editors are doing their best to dispell Handsome Dick Manitoba's quote "In my book quantity is quality"Tom W (Fla. not FL) | October 15, 2008, 9:16pm | #
Just don't flash McCain the Queen of Diamonds, he'll get all Manchurian Candidate on our ass.rhywun | October 15, 2008, 9:17pm | #
Don't mind me picking up "plumber" as tonight's drinking word.I'm already drunk.
nobody | October 15, 2008, 9:17pm | #
3-0 Phila. I wonder what this city is like when people are happy.Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:18pm | #
John McCain is sounding like a retard.BobDobalina | October 15, 2008, 9:18pm | #
More soundbites and crap. McCain is not going to "knock it out the box," or do a Bush-in-1984 and whip anyone's ass.Bottom line, the Republicans need to suck it up, realize that they've lost this election and then contemplate how their slavish obeisance to Dubya destroyed whatever credibility they've had.
If they are wise, they'll figure out a way to ditch the religious nutjobs and neocons and create a new conservative-libertarian based political initiative.
The only thing that we as libertarians have on our side under the coming Obama presidency is that rubber of reality will hit the road when the "magic pot of money to redistribute the wealth" fails to materialize and the Democrats will have to make choices from among their various factions, all of whom want a check at the expense of some other person's dwindling pockets.
phalkor | October 15, 2008, 9:18pm | #
I don't believe thst McCain knows what he say he knows...He's on my watch list.
SIV | October 15, 2008, 9:19pm | #
Taxes are going up on everybody, not just the "working families who earn more than $250k".Hell even Bob Lutz of GM wants a floor under gas prices so the Volt won't crash and burn.
nonPaulogist | October 15, 2008, 9:19pm | #
Johnny is getting senile. The line-item veto was already ruled unconstitutional.Cheezwizard | October 15, 2008, 9:19pm | #
Eliminate the tariff on Brazilian sugarcane? Is the maverick taking on HFCS? O noes!Mister DNA | October 15, 2008, 9:20pm | #
Where are Nick Gillespie and Kerry Howley?John | October 15, 2008, 9:20pm | #
A scalpel won't work against the federal leviathan.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:20pm | #
If they are wise, they'll figure out a way to ditch the religious nutjobs and neocons and create a new conservative-libertarian based political initiative.Nah, they'll chalk this one up to McCain not being Jesus-y enough. Huckabee 2012!
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:21pm | #
"Senator Obama, President Bush is a friend of mine, and I'm no President Bush"Cheezwizard | October 15, 2008, 9:22pm | #
Doesn't really have the same ring to it.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:23pm | #
WTF was that face at the mention of "Fox News"Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:23pm | #
McCain has that forced grin. Why does he do that?Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:24pm | #
I'm out of cheap wine and I kinda want to get some falafel but I might miss a worthwhile gaffe.Argh, too many choices!
phalkor | October 15, 2008, 9:24pm | #
epic foxnews slam! he's throwin rocks tonight!on second thought
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:24pm | #
McCain has to watch that temper...Why is he letting shit get to him?Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:25pm | #
Wow, Obama is super saiyan tonight. McCain had better whip out the Ayers card quick!Jerry | October 15, 2008, 9:25pm | #
This is a great surreal debate because Obama & McCain can;t just read off their paper script in tonight's format.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:26pm | #
Ha, Bob says, "sack up, nancy boys!"Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:26pm | #
Obama should watch smirking- | October 15, 2008, 9:26pm | #
You know? I don't really care if they get mean and negative in a campaign. It's expected, and you gotta do what you gotta do to point out the other fool's shortcomings. As long as whoever I'm for gets negative too, then I don't care.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:27pm | #
I thought for a second McCain was going to cry a la Clinton in NH.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:27pm | #
John Lewis, civil rights hero, hurt my feelings.| October 15, 2008, 9:27pm | #
That's it. The moderator wins.BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:28pm | #
"I thought for a second McCain was going to cry a la Clinton in NH."Well, he's tried to copy everything else from the Hillary Clinton campaign so he may as well.
Morris | October 15, 2008, 9:28pm | #
Well it's obvious McCain isn't going to win by being nice and sweet, so he may as well go down fighting hard instead of turning the other cheek.BobDobalina | October 15, 2008, 9:28pm | #
Nah, they'll chalk this one up to McCain not being Jesus-y enough.Hell, Jesus Himself isn't Jesusy enough for these Republicans!
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:28pm | #
100%? McCain's campaign ads are more negative yes, but that's a crazy commentIan | October 15, 2008, 9:29pm | #
McCain's campaign ads are now 100% negative. They haven't always been. Not sure why Obama didn't properly qualify that.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:29pm | #
"McCain isn't going to win by being nice and sweet"Yeah, he's been so nice and sweet lately as he falls in the polls...
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:31pm | #
Joe the plumber, doggonit!Sparky | October 15, 2008, 9:31pm | #
"So, to summarize, say what you want about me. I can take the slings and arrows, but stop slandering poor, defenseless, Blinky."**Only a moron wouldn't cast his vote for Monty Burns!!**
Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:31pm | #
Joe the Plumber again!Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:31pm | #
The 'my underdog hometown team beat the Evil Empire' would have been a powerful weapon in more capable hands.Charles | October 15, 2008, 9:32pm | #
This would be a better REASON liveblog thing if a few of the better commenters were invited.Morris | October 15, 2008, 9:32pm | #
Barack's just pissed off that he's got more for McCain to pick on and attack him for with all his suspicious activities.They both attack, and they should both attack. Get over it. That's the game they signed up for and people should quit whining about negativity.
Sarah Palin being called a cunt on t-shirts pretty much negates the "kill him" and "off with his head" whining.
An honest question | October 15, 2008, 9:32pm | #
Are any libertarians here going to hold your nose and vote for a major party POTUS candidate? If so who and why?Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:32pm | #
John Lewis ate breakfast with Bill Ayers, known terroristGilbert Martin | October 15, 2008, 9:33pm | #
When Obama started that crap about giving 95% of the people a tax cut, McCain should have pointed out that 95% of the people don't pay taxes in the first place.Giving people who don't pay taxes money isn't a "tax cut" - it's a welfare payment.
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:33pm | #
The Ayers thing was going to pass unstated; why the heck did Obama allude to it?Ian | October 15, 2008, 9:34pm | #
McCain looks flustered and upset. He does not look Presidential.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:34pm | #
It's crazy for a man with McCain's experience to get so angryJohn C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:35pm | #
Poor wittle pussy McCain had his wittle feelings hurt. And the big bad black bully just doesnt care.BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:35pm | #
McCain needs some valium.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:35pm | #
Gilbert95% of the people don't pay taxes? Are you stoned?
Kaiser | October 15, 2008, 9:35pm | #
Was it just me or did Obama correct Mccain on Cardinals v. Cowboys? I believe Obama said it was the Redskins however I am pretty sure it was Cardinals v. CowboysTelly | October 15, 2008, 9:36pm | #
Deny and deflect, deny and deflect.BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:36pm | #
ACORN!Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:36pm | #
Where is the moderator?Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:36pm | #
This seems like the longest segment for a single 'topic' of any of the previous three debates.It almost ran out of steam until McCain started running downfield right now.
Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:36pm | #
Wow, the Barr feed is just a complete clusterfuck this time. Why are they doing internet streaming instead of a TV?Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:36pm | #
KaiserI think he said "congratulations"
| | October 15, 2008, 9:37pm | #
I actually like emotion and heart in my president. Bill Clinton was like that.| October 15, 2008, 9:37pm | #
McCain looks flustered and upset. He does not look Presidential.You haven't seen many of our presidents in action, have you?
phalkor | October 15, 2008, 9:37pm | #
well I haven't had my lobotomy yet so I can't really call myself a libertarian. But, I did vote for Bush in the last election, with little or no feeling of conviction except to spite the liberal mobs on campus.now, I am very disgusted with both parties. I can't ever feel like it's an Us vs Them in two party politics anymore.
damn, is there a good reason to vote for either of them? they offer nothing
Cheezwizard | October 15, 2008, 9:38pm | #
WTF is ACORN?Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:38pm | #
Which was a bizarre thing to say either wayMr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:39pm | #
He can dis the Cowboys, he ain't gonna win TX either wayKaiser | October 15, 2008, 9:39pm | #
Mr. Nice GuyAhh too bad, that could've been a major gaffe! Oh well back to the boredom.
Ash Lux | October 15, 2008, 9:39pm | #
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACORNJerry | October 15, 2008, 9:39pm | #
The squirrels have landed...John | October 15, 2008, 9:40pm | #
Obama's self-defensive smiles are getting pretty annoying.Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:40pm | #
LOL| October 15, 2008, 9:41pm | #
boy, talk about putting land mine under McCainMr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:41pm | #
"WTF is ACORN?"American
Congress
Of
Republican
Nativists
They were a community group headed by Lonewhacko bent on catching illegal immigrants and releasing them in Argentina
rhywun | October 15, 2008, 9:41pm | #
Better than rolling his eyesKing of the Hill Dad | October 15, 2008, 9:42pm | #
I just think Obama is a liar. I've read both sides of all crap that's out there, proven or not, and I don't know what to take for truth anymore. But my deep gut feeling is that he's just a damn liar. He ain't caught yet, but it's likely that he's a great big bullshit free riding phony.John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:42pm | #
Joe "six pack" BidenKolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:42pm | #
Per Jesse Walker's 9:40Well, that exchange was excruciatingly long, but McCain did get some good shots in, and imo was his best performance so far tonight. (but which ain't saying much)
Kaiser | October 15, 2008, 9:42pm | #
At this point I don't believe anything can help Mccain. IF he had voted no on the bailout, and IF he had then come out strong against Obama being a socialist I believe quite honestly he would be in the lead. However screwed the pooch on that one by voting for the bailout and turning to attack ads. Which subsequently in normal elections probably would have worked.John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:43pm | #
Nailin' PailinSIV | October 15, 2008, 9:43pm | #
Obama is touting Biden's support for federal "Crime Bills". More police, draconian drug sentences,destruction of civil liberties and gun control.We'll get more of it Obamatarians.James Butler | October 15, 2008, 9:44pm | #
That clinches it ... my sphincter, I mean. McCain needs someone to change his diaper ... he's getting whiny. I cannot stomach the man. Before this debate, at least I could give him the benefit of the doubt, but that's gone. He is just behaving like a spoiled little bratty kid who can't think of anything except for stinky feet. His smirks and complete avoidance of any substance, his continuing repetition of total, naked lies and innuendo ... he makes me physically ill. Unbelievable. I'm disgusted by that one.John C jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:44pm | #
Fuck special needs families. Seriously. What the fuck does that have to do with being a heartbeat away from the presidency?joe | October 15, 2008, 9:44pm | #
This is a rout.I called the first one a tie, leaning McCain.
I called the second one a close win for Obama.
This is a rout.
Mr. Nice guy | October 15, 2008, 9:44pm | #
Sarah PalinStood up to intra-party corruption
Has insight on special needs children
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:44pm | #
WTF was that again? "what they call 'the lower 48?'"It would have been perfectly fine to say "relieve the energy crunch of The United States" or even 'our country' you know, the one that's 'first'
Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:45pm | #
Obama wants to point out that she is a dumbass, but hesitates. Why?joe | October 15, 2008, 9:45pm | #
Hi, SIV.I'm not writing talking points at all, and you are.
Know why?
rhywun | October 15, 2008, 9:45pm | #
I'd trade the Drug Czar for a Special Needs Czar any day.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:45pm | #
Is Obama's answer to everything to just throw more money at it?Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:45pm | #
'cockamamie' is a word I have never heard from anyone under Monty Burns age.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:46pm | #
"More police, draconian drug sentences,destruction of civil liberties and gun control.We'll get more of it Obamatarians."None of that from the GOP, nope. The GOP stands bravely for the rights of the accused and against expansion of police rights...
BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:46pm | #
A rout for who, joe?Dave | October 15, 2008, 9:46pm | #
"Is Obama's answer to everything to just throw more money at it?"pretty much
Reinmoose | October 15, 2008, 9:46pm | #
McCain:TAXES GOD DAMNIT! LETS TALK ABOUT TAXES!!!!
TAXES!!
FUCK HIM! DAMNIT DAMNIT DAMNIT!
Orange Line Special | October 15, 2008, 9:47pm | #
BHO lied about his involvement with ACORN, which is much more extensive - and recent - than he indicated. Now he's off on a distraction about who his advisors are.Note also his reaction to McCain's attack: he could barely speak for a few seconds. If a regular citizen - not an MSM hack - really pressed him on something who knows what he'd say?
SIV | October 15, 2008, 9:47pm | #
Why joe?John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:47pm | #
I live in Ohio. There would be no oil checks here. We could be swimming in oil and there would be 18 million tax raise ballot issues.John McCain | October 15, 2008, 9:48pm | #
Let the fools have their tartar sauceDave | October 15, 2008, 9:48pm | #
Lol! I think McCain just sneered. That was awesome!Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:48pm | #
Yes, but what about nuclear power pants?BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:48pm | #
Joe--I'm horrible at calling these things. I don't know what Joe Plumber would say.
Bob | October 15, 2008, 9:48pm | #
"Now let's talk about LoneWacko - useful idiot, or just idiot?"John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:49pm | #
Isn't cockamamie a racist slur about "black mamies"?sage | October 15, 2008, 9:49pm | #
He, any of you guys had the Big Vinnie pizza from Round Table? We're trying it tonight.So is it still giant douche or turd sandwich?
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:49pm | #
Navy Nuclear power is closer to 50 years.Following her commissioning, Nautilus remained dockside for further construction and testing. At 11:00 hours on January 17, 1955 she put to sea for the first time and signaled her historic message: "Underway on nuclear power."
Kaiser | October 15, 2008, 9:50pm | #
Am I the only person still alive that finds this idea of global warming to be bullshit? Er, let me rephrase that..."man made" global warming. Don't get me wrong alternative energy is great but should be pursued by private entities. Not something funded by the government because of some widespread fear that if we don't stop using oil right this second we will all implode.Lest we not forget.... every time we breathe, we emit "green house gasses" I say a good solution is for everyone who believes in global warming just hold their breath for as long as possible every day.
joe | October 15, 2008, 9:50pm | #
BDB,The post-debate polls tonight and tomorrow and this weekend are going to be substantially better for Barack Obama this time than they were in the second debate, and those polls were pretty good.
Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:50pm | #
Sweet, government-issued electric-Yugos for everyone!Sarah Palin | October 15, 2008, 9:50pm | #
""Now let's talk about LoneWacko - useful idiot, or just idiot?""Useful. God has a plan even for people with special needs..
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:51pm | #
Obama's answer always raises the question:So why *can't* the Big 2 1/2 or 2 or whatever it's going to be build fuel efficient cars, but the Asians can?
King of the Hill Dad | October 15, 2008, 9:51pm | #
"every time we breathe, we emit "green house gasses""Especially after eating some wicked Thai.
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:51pm | #
"Am I the only person still alive that finds this idea of global warming to be bullshit?"No, lots of people think its bullshit. And lots of people think that angels visit Earth regularly.
BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:52pm | #
We'll see. I think McCain looks really uncomfortable and angry, but again I'm not Joe the Plumber in Methville.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:52pm | #
Kolohe:Obviously because Uncle Sam hasn't given them enough money.
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
Wait, McCain's trying to make a point that Obama is not 'international' *enough*?joe | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
Oh my God, McCain's talking about drilling.That barely worked when gas was four bucks.
pgt | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
Biden "has been on the right side" of the critical issues throughout his career?Of course I really can't expect McCain to point out how often Biden called for military action and warned about Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction.
Shirt | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
Kaiser,I don't care about global warming. I care about alternative energy so the people of the Middle East can go back to their nomadic, barely subsisting ways.
rhywun | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
Am I the only person still alive that finds this idea of global warming to be bullshit?I'll let the scienticians decide that one.
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
Did McCain just say he wants to send workers to community college?So they can one day be his VP?
JC | October 15, 2008, 9:53pm | #
I'm glad Matt Welch is tearing into Obama. I only ever saw him negative on McCain (his book and all). But it is nice to see he hates Obama pretty equally.BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:54pm | #
McCain nearly lost it on Colombian free trade. I thought he was going to punch Obama in the face.joe | October 15, 2008, 9:54pm | #
BDB,Barack Obama has been hoping to get John McCain to act like this for months, and tonight, he did.
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:54pm | #
Obama should do a photo op in Dillon, SC tomorrow.alan | October 15, 2008, 9:54pm | #
labor is under killed per population in Columbia. as fucked up as that may sound, it is true.John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:54pm | #
JC,Maybe Welch is a libertarian? Libertarians don't care for either of these clowns..
Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:55pm | #
Obama is guarantee that we can all spend money and buy fuel-efficient cars and thus save the economy, the Big 2.5 AND the environment.It's so simple!
John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 9:56pm | #
Hooooooooooooover!Kaiser | October 15, 2008, 9:56pm | #
"No, lots of people think its bullshit. And lots of people think that angels visit Earth regularly."I realize that the earth is in a warming trend. I also however realize that it cools off. I don't believe that man made global warming is real in any form. Coming at this from a scientific point of view, we as people have only been on this planet for a fraction of 1% of it's entire life. All of which, by the way, has been in a warming period. To honestly believe that we have such a huge impact on the planet in such a small amount of time seems to take a certain level of arrogance that I can not attain.
Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:56pm | #
Hoover, drink.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:56pm | #
"Obama has never been to Mexico."Neither has Sarah Palin, but she says she can see it from Alaska
John McCain | October 15, 2008, 9:56pm | #
Hello my friends, this is Johnny checking in. I just wanted to say, my friends, that I appreciate your support for free markets. I also like free markets, my friends.I know how to make markets free.
I know how to make the economy freer.
We will lower taxes.
We will defeat this enemy.
My friends, I just have two words.
Bill Ayers.
Ironic | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
Mr. Nice Guy, I believe in global warming, I just do not think humans have a (measurable) impact on it. Can you explain global warming on Mars? What about the Little Ice Age?BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
It's really funny that whatever weakness Obama has, Palin has it ten times worse.SIV | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
Free health care !joe | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
"Isn't it obvious?"No.
*shrug* We got people who couldn't believe that anyone would think Kerry was winning on the debate threads four years ago.
There's no accounting for taste, I guess.
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
Damn you Sparky, that's twice tonight ;)Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
I can't see how Obama won't wipe the floor in the eyes of the voters in this healthcare segmentSparky | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #
"Coming at this from a scientific point of view..."Surely you can't honestly think the crap you typed after this is actually a "scientific point of view," can you?
King of the Hill Dad | October 15, 2008, 9:58pm | #
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are perfect examples of what the government could do for your health care.Jerry | October 15, 2008, 9:58pm | #
"we're going to try to do" like in Cuba.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
"Manage" heart disease and diabetes? Is this a reference to the "obesity epidemic"?Shirt | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
Kaiser,I'm with you. But dependence on oil only continues the power of the oil cartel. Oil is going to run out -- it's inevitable. The country that kicks its dependency first will have a huge advantage over everyone else.
Pendulum | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
Excellent answer on health care by Obama.McCain: put records on intertubez! save hlthcr!
Bingo | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
Argh, physical fitness programs and nutrition programs. Fuck these assholes.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
We have physical fitness programs in schools.That was Arnie's first political job.
Caligula | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
McCain preaching about obesity?BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:59pm | #
Because he'd rather talk about Ayers, John.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
Look, I don't want to threadjack, but when they ask the folks with Phd's in the relevant fields and who work in those fields every day if there is global warming that is effected by man, and the consensus, from the vast majority of them, from various nations, organizations, ideologies, etc., is yes, then I tend to defer to their judgment on that, yes.alan | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
BDB | October 15, 2008, 9:57pm | #It's really funny that whatever weakness Obama has, Palin has it ten times worse.
Sad more than funny. Hey JSM just said he is giving me some money!
joe | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
"Spread the wealth around" is the new "tire gauge."Exactly the same people who repeated tire gauge fifty times a day three months ago, thinking they've really got a winner now, are going to repeat "spread the wealth around" fifty times a day, thinking the same thing.
Charles | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
I will strangle Joe the plumber with my bare hands.Ironic | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
I am not watching the debate. I am only reading the liveblog. Am I missing anything?rhywun | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
OMG I'm so drunk.Pendulum | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
Joe, do you want to pay a fine?Caligula | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
Joe returns.Sparky | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
"Damn you Sparky, that's twice tonight ;)"I've been inspired by Joe the plumber.
BDB | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #
Who cares if global warming is man made or not? Cleaner energy is a good thing, anyway.Fluffy | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
In more important news, Leanne won Project Runway.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
"Why the hell can't McCain talk about Smoote Hawley?"Uhh, because it's just not a widely acknowledged fact that it caused the Depression?
Will | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
I want Joe the Plumbers autograph!!!Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
Reagan Democrats.Soccer Moms.
Nascar Dads.
Joe the Plumber.
Evolution bitches!
BobDobalina | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
Well, Obama shot his Ayers-ACORN wad. Now what?Meanwhile, Obama justs steps over the pile and promises more health care, healing of the lepers, and eyesight to the blind (NOW, new and improved with MORE Unicorns and Ponies!!!).
What's left for them to bullshit over in the last half hour?
Ahhh, Joe the Plumber just came back up. I hope that Joe has opened up an account on CafePress and starts marketing himself properly!!!
SIV | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
McCain's health care plan is one of the few things I like about his platform.Not that he could actually deliver on it as President though.BDB | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
How about "Joe the Plumber", Joe? Bill Bennett said pre-debate that "Joe the Plumber" would win the debate for McCain. I had no fucking idea what he was talking about, but now I do.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #
If there's liquor rationing I'm moving to Venezuela.Ironic | October 15, 2008, 10:02pm | #
Mr. Nice Guy, many of them have be bribed -um excuse me I mean funded - by organizations with an agenda.joe | October 15, 2008, 10:02pm | #
Because none of that is true, John.John McCain just barely knows real economics, you can't expect him to be up on fringe wacko stuff. He probably can't talk like a goldbug, either.
Franklin Harris | October 15, 2008, 10:02pm | #
Joe the Plumber is the new version of William Raspberry's cabbie.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:03pm | #
"But hey, it is settled consensus."Yeah John, all those Phd's never even thought to check that evidence out and have no answer to that. You totally did their jobs better than they did.
BTW-what other scientific consensuses have you seen through? Enlighten us.
alan | October 15, 2008, 10:03pm | #
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:01pm | #"Why the hell can't McCain talk about Smoote Hawley?"
Uhh, because it's just not a widely acknowledged fact that it caused the Depression?
Like hell. Speaking of econ professors I had not a single one, liberal, free market, or other wise who did not think it was a major contributing factor.
Charles | October 15, 2008, 10:04pm | #
I will waterboard Joe the Plumber.BDB | October 15, 2008, 10:04pm | #
Who gives a fuck if its man made or not man made? Getting off of oil is a GOOD thing no matter what. It's such a stupid debate.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 10:04pm | #
We are so fucked.rhywun | October 15, 2008, 10:04pm | #
Fluffy, SPOILER ALERT?? Goddamn it.joe | October 15, 2008, 10:05pm | #
BDB,Obama's answer about Joe the Plumber five years ago, when he wasn't in a position to be buying a business or entering the top tax bracket, needing the tax cut more, was immensely successful.
Jon B. Quick | October 15, 2008, 10:05pm | #
Why doesn't McCain talk about the fact that more Americans are killed by illegal immigrants every year than died on 9/11? Go defend Korea and Georgia you angry, elderly fascist.I hope Plumber Joe's daughter gets raped by an illegal.
John | October 15, 2008, 10:05pm | #
"Because none of that is true, John."Smoote Hawley had nothing to do with the Depression? Are fucking insane Joe? What history books have you been reading? If there is one settled fact on like oh page 1 of the history of the depression it is that Smoote hawley turned a down turn into a depression and that the collapse of the world markets caused the depression to last so long.
What else do you want to tell us tonight Joe? slavery had nothing to do with the civil war? Taxes had nothing to do with the American Revolution? Napoleon's invasion of Russia had nothing to do with his downfall?
King of the Hill Dad | October 15, 2008, 10:05pm | #
Government healthcare:- No, we don't provide lasik surgery for anyone over 50. You're probably going to die and won't need your eyes much longer.
- Yes, we'll pay for your gastric bypass even though you're a big fat lard ass that sits around and eats McDonalds all day every day.
- Yes, your 13 year old on-her-way to sluthood daughter can come in with her 17 year old crack head boyfriend and we'll make sure they're prepared to have sex.
- No, you can't have that new kind of medicine. We want you to take this old kind that the FDA hasn't gotten around to banning yet even though it's induced strokes and blood clots in 43% of the people who've taken it.
- Oh, and guess what. You're co-pay at your choice of doctor is $75, but at the local HMO office next to the welfare office, it's only five dollars.
Joe The Plumber | October 15, 2008, 10:05pm | #
Hey guys. I just have one thing to say to Senator McCain...FUCK YOU!
And to Senator Obama
FUCK YOU!
And to Bob Schiefer
FUCK YOU!
And to the Joe Six Packs...
FUCK YOU!
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:05pm | #
IronicThere are so many thousands that agree...What % do you think are on the take?
Jesus please stop with the Joe the Plumber shit. Jesus! Who the fuck told him that line?
Nick | October 15, 2008, 10:06pm | #
Can I put my $5k credit towards medical marijuana?Kaiser | October 15, 2008, 10:06pm | #
Like I said don't get me wrong. I am all for alternative energies. I just don't believe it should be on the backs of the tax payers because the world has come to a consensus that we are fucking it up. I think the idea of man made global warming is a joke quite frankly, and just because the world is in some panic over it I have to pay more taxes?| October 15, 2008, 10:06pm | #
Bill Bennett said pre-debate that "Joe the Plumber" would win the debate for McCain.It sounds like no matter what, Joe the Plumber is gonna be taking it in the shorts.
Devil's Advocate | October 15, 2008, 10:06pm | #
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:00pm | #And all the "experts" in the financial community told us that the bailout bill was the cat's pajamas. When your in for a shitload of other people's money its amazing how easy it is to build a consensus.
Fluffy | October 15, 2008, 10:06pm | #
Uhh, because it's just not a widely acknowledged fact that it caused the Depression?Put the crack pipe down. It's the one factor contributing to the Depression that is agreed upon by economists and historians of just about every ideological stripe. Smoot Hawley has fewer defenders than just about any legislation in US history, including the Alien and Sedition Acts. You'd have to branch out into legal decisions and use Plessy v. Ferguson or Dred Scott to find something more universally disdained. And that might not even do it. You might have to drag out the 3/5th's Compromise or the Trail of Tears or something.
Ironic | October 15, 2008, 10:06pm | #
Please tell me that by some miracle neither of these people will be our next POTUS?Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 10:07pm | #
And at the last minute, having exhausted all alternatives, McCain selects a successful strategy and runs against Congress.And then promptly drops it.
BobDobalina | October 15, 2008, 10:07pm | #
Joe, I'm available to work as your Agent. My commission is 15%, right after Obama gets his share ...SIV | October 15, 2008, 10:07pm | #
YesWe are totally fucked.
Kaiser | October 15, 2008, 10:07pm | #
Mccain a federalist? There's a good joke for ya....tom from ohio | October 15, 2008, 10:07pm | #
The one merciful thing about this campaign is that we have not been subjected to blather about the "judges" issue. You know, until right this instant.joe | October 15, 2008, 10:07pm | #
Smoote Hawley had nothing to do with the Depression?No, it has nothing to do with anything being discussed in contemporary politics.
Deep breaths, John. Easy, big fella. Easy now.
John C Jackson | October 15, 2008, 10:08pm | #
Justice Breyer? Obama voted on that?Ironic | October 15, 2008, 10:08pm | #
"There are so many thousands that agree...What % do you think are on the take? "So many thousands. It is called "funding" often via tax dollars. Funding, they want to keep getting funding.
BDB | October 15, 2008, 10:08pm | #
JOE THE PLUMBER FOR THE SUPREME COURT!Bingo | October 15, 2008, 10:08pm | #
Oh goody, I wonder what sort of ideological standards McCain would appoint to the Supreme Court.Blue Light Special | October 15, 2008, 10:09pm | #
more Americans are killed by illegal immigrants every year than died on 9/11What the fuck
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:09pm | #
"Speaking of econ professors I had not a single one, liberal, free market, or other wise who did not think it was a major contributing factor."Well, that's a sample you can certainly generalize from! I mean, certainly economists don't question that Smoot-Hawley caused the Depression...
Like the guy who just won the Nobel in that subject?
John | October 15, 2008, 10:09pm | #
The most important thing is to "provide fairness and justice to the American people" or uphold and protect the Constitution. You know, same thing.Bingo | October 15, 2008, 10:10pm | #
Both of these assholes are about as anti-1st amendment as you can get. Any rights you have should be subject to popular vote did I just hear that?John | October 15, 2008, 10:10pm | #
BTW-what other scientific consensuses have you seen through? Enlighten us.There are no other consensus you moron because that is not how science is done. Every other field of science is done through experimentation and predicable and repeatable results. Only global warming is settled by "consensus". Just because someone in a lab coat tells you its true doesn't mean it is. There are lots of reputable scientists who don't buy global warming or if they do think the predictions made about it are wildly out of line. they are in the minority but that doesn't mean they are not right.
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 10:11pm | #
Ledbetter was correctly decided. It's up to congress to 'fix the glitch' if they want to| October 15, 2008, 10:11pm | #
ha! abortion! time for all good Republicans to grab their weenies and bellow in their best William F. Buckley voice, "God and Morality! God and Morality! Decency! Decency!"Charles | October 15, 2008, 10:11pm | #
Reason bloggers, if you're going to list all the places McCain is not a federalist, you're going to miss the next twenty minutes of awesome, awesome debating.tom from ohio | October 15, 2008, 10:11pm | #
"I'd love to hear whether Obama thinks the Second Amendment should apply to the states."I'd love to hear someone ask McCain if he even knows what incorporation is.
BDB | October 15, 2008, 10:12pm | #
Here comes the infanticide stuff.Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 10:12pm | #
And inferring a right to 'equal pay' in the constitution is about the worse thing I've ever heard.SIV | October 15, 2008, 10:12pm | #
Yes! McCain is taking Weigel's advice.I bet he blows it though.C'mon John Wave that bloody baby!
Pendulum | October 15, 2008, 10:12pm | #
OMG Obama, please don't talk about Ledbetter. I'd like to vote for you, but I can't do it if you talk like that.Talk sweet to me. I like it when you do that "right to privacy" thing. Do it again.
Fluffy | October 15, 2008, 10:12pm | #
MNG, produce a link to Krugman saying that Smoot-Hawley did not contribute to the Depression, or stop being a dick.Link. Produce it.
Since you almost certainly won't find such a link, produce a link to a credible economist or historian who is willing to step up to the plate to defend Smoot-Hawley.
Robert Reich is neither an economist nor a historian, by the way.
The Angry Optimist | October 15, 2008, 10:13pm | #
Obama says that judges should ignore the law and just allow Betty to bring her case, dammit!PAc | October 15, 2008, 10:13pm | #
McCain's theme of hammering about taking Joe's money, raising his taxes, and spreading the wealth around would have worked ten years ago. Today, it just makes me want to punch him in the face for being full of shit.And Barr, fuck, he can't even go to the third party Cspan debate this weekend. WHat is he, too good to hang around with the second string.
Ian | October 15, 2008, 10:13pm | #
McCain: "We have to change the culture of America." We do?What's wrong with our culture?
PC | October 15, 2008, 10:13pm | #
Yes there has been nothing but a clear and consistent consensus on globalLe lapin | October 15, 2008, 10:14pm | #
Why don't they ask about race & IQ?King of the Hill Dad | October 15, 2008, 10:14pm | #
Why in the hell are we talking about abortion? Please! I'd rather the welfare dead beats be able to get an easy abortion, instead of tax payers having another welfare mouth to feed.joe | October 15, 2008, 10:14pm | #
There are no other consensus you moron because that is not how science is done.There's no consensus that electricity and magnetism are the same force. There's no consensus that vitamin C cures scurvy. There's no consensus that species evolved from earlier forms.
Oh wait, there is. Hey, moron, do you believe everything someone in a lab coat tells you?
Climate scientists don't use observation to test hypotheses, which they then refine based on the results, you moron. They all drop a bunch of acid, see what they find in their notebooks the next morning, and then agree that they're all going to say it's true, just to screw you.
Moron.
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
"There are no other consensus you moron because that is not how science is done. Every other field of science is done through experimentation and predicable and repeatable results. Only global warming is settled by "consensus"."Sigh. Hundreds and hundreds of peer reviewed articles, reporting the findings of thousands of scientists engaging in experimentation, provide findings that, when read by other thousands of experts, causes all of these varied experts to agree that the evidence is there. Hence the consensus...
James Butler | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
BTW, McCain's emphasizing "Joe the Plumber" to banish the "six-pack" fantasy. Why? The Busch wholesaler racket connection. It's starting to come out, and he doesn't want to encourage it.Amakudari | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
Like hell. Speaking of econ professors I had not a single one, liberal, free market, or other wise who did not think it was a major contributing factor.Ditto. But Smoot-Hawley's not general knowledge and won't get any play in a debate for a lay audience. Joe the Plumber don't like it.
Maybe it's just me, but I wish McCain had pressed Obama on his automaker comments. I mean, the Japanese have plenty of plants in Ohio and Tennessee, so they bring their yen here and make cars in America. And US taxpayers have been the backstop for the Big Two/Two-Point-Five/Three for a while with just about zero positive impact. I can understand why McCain wouldn't insult Detroit, but then he shifts to some non sequitur about Chavez? Please.
(And my response is way behind.)
JC | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
Is it possible to be pro-choice and think Roe v. Wade was bad jurisprudence? Or is it too hard for the majority of Americans to think about?Mister DNA | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
Ladies and gentlemen, tonight the role of Tom Servo will be played by Jesse Walker.Jerry | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
How about they just use a condom Obama?alan | October 15, 2008, 10:15pm | #
Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:09pm | #"Speaking of econ professors I had not a single one, liberal, free market, or other wise who did not think it was a major contributing factor."
Well, that's a sample you can certainly generalize from! I mean, certainly economists don't question that Smoot-Hawley caused the Depression...
Like the guy who just won the Nobel in that subject?
Do yourself a favor and change the subject.
Libertarian | October 15, 2008, 10:16pm | #
Congratulations, boys (I guess you're all boys -- I'm not sure about "Fluffy") you're a lot more entertaining than those high-paid editors, assistant editors, chief editors, etc. from reason who are live-blogging.Mr. Nice Guy | October 15, 2008, 10:16pm | #
fluffyhttp://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/SmootHawley.htm
For starters
Reinmoose | October 15, 2008, 10:16pm | #
McCain "pro-abortion movement"Bogeyman much? There's no such thing
Jerry | October 15, 2008, 10:16pm | #
I don't think McCain supports adoption by gay couples?King of the Hill Dad | October 15, 2008, 10:16pm | #
"Is it possible to be pro-choice and think Roe v. Wade was bad jurisprudence? Or is it too hard for the majority of Americans to think about?"yep, very possible. That's where I am on it.
tom from ohio | October 15, 2008, 10:17pm | #
Allowing abortion to "protect the health of the mother" is an extremist pro-abortion stance? Uh, isn't that even more restrictive than U.S. law right now?David Rollins | October 15, 2008, 10:17pm | #
The best part about watching the debate on CNBC? When Obama starts speaking they put him in a box so they can show the Nikkei losing 900 points.Priorities, people.
Kolohe | October 15, 2008, 10:17pm | #
Math and Science ed. W00t!(if the govt backs that *and* nuclear power I'll never have to worry about having a job for the rest of my life)
tacos34 | October 15, 2008, 10:17pm | #
the most interesting aspect of this debate is whether or not Horses is good (its not). Trout Mask Replica is however.zeiner the lurker | October 15, 2008, 10:17pm | #
sorry,